Meeting of Griffith, Barton and Gavan Duffy with Llyod George, Chamberlain, Birkenhead and Horne

Introduction from Chronology

Barton, Gavan Duffy and Childers, back in London, work on amendments to the Proposed Articles of Association.  Griffith, Collins and Duggan were not keen on making amendments but, after some discussion, they did agree to some changes.  A key change was changing the word Association to Associated States in the Oath as, without this (they said), the Oath could be interpreted as the accepting the King as head of the Irish state. The amendments are given as Appendix 20 in Macardle (1999). 

They Irish side made no suggested changes to the clauses on Ulster (as the Irish delegates had no specific instructions to do so). Therefore, when they met later, the British assumed that, since there were no suggested changes, the Irish side were satisfied with these clauses.

After the amendments were made, Collins and Duggan refused to go to Downing St so Griffith, Barton and Gavan Duffy went to push them on the British. This was to turn into a dramatic meeting.

 

More Detail

Griffith, Barton and Gavan Duffy meet with Llyod George, Chamberlain, Birkenhead and Horne at 5.00pm.  The British side read the amendments and rejected them.  Griffith tried to bring out Craig’s refusal of an All-Ireland Parliament as the dominant factor but the British said that their proposals stood with or without Craig’s approval. 

When Gavan Duffy came to speak he said “our difficulty is to come inside the Empire, looking to all that has happened in the past …”.  One of the British negotiators said “in that case, it is war”.  With that the British delegation jumped to their feet and said the conference was at an end.  They said they would send word to Craig that the negotiations had broken down.

Kenny says that “He [Gavan Duffy] had given them their chance to break [on Crown and Empire rather than Ulster]” (Kenny (2021), pg 94).

Writing later to de Valera about this meeting, Griffith said “They [the British] asked what was the difficulty about going in like Canada in the Empire? Gavan Duffy said that we should be closely associated with them as the Dominion [such as Canada] in the large matters, and more so in the matter of defence but our difficulty is coming within the Empire. They jumped at this and the conversation came to a close, we undertaking to send in a formal rejection tomorrow.  They would, they said, inform Craig tomorrow that the negotiations were broken down. We then parted.” (Kenny (2021), pg 92).

However, later that night Thomas Jones told Collins that Llyod George wished to see him in the morning. (However, Fanning says that it was Griffith who wanted Collins to see Llyod George but he told Collins that Llyod George wanted to see him.  Fanning has a lot of detail on what happened this night.  See also Kenny (2021), pgs 95-96)   

Llyod George had learned of who was on each side in the Irish cabinet (and presumably that there was a 4 to 3 majority for signing the Treaty).

Back